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KitchensDesign DilemmaRenovating
choco_bear

Corner Bifold Option?

choco_bear
3 years ago

We would love to have bifold doors out into our garden where we will also be decking to create a seamless space. We were wondering whether it would be possible to have a corner bifold to replace the current bay window with patio doors.
Mock up plan of garden also attached for an idea of what we had in mind.
All thoughts welcome!
Thank you

Featured Answer
  • Sarah U-S
    3 years ago

    Are you planning on extending or just replacing your current doors and windows? Sorry to put a negative on, but I actually think your current set up looks fab and a lot nicer than bifolds! Having read lots of previous posts from other people, lots of people (me included) who have bifolds regret them, because in reality, they often don’t get used. As I say, I’m one of these! We have bifolds and in the past 12 years we have fully opened them maybe twice! We end up using the first opener as a single door. I dream of swapping to something like yours 😂

    Comments (21)

    • choco_bear
      Original Author
      3 years ago

      Ground floor plan for reference

    • PRO
      Eulinea Ltd
      3 years ago

      Yes, you can get corner by-fold doors


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    • PRO
      Room-by-Room (UK) Ltd
      3 years ago

      Hello,

      anything is possible with enough money. What is your budget for the corner bi-fold?


      Best wishes


      Andrew

    • choco_bear
      Original Author
      3 years ago

      Thanks for your responses. The corner bifold picture looks great, do you know if it is possible to have it all fold to one end rather than split as shown in that picture? As in it all folds to the left hand side as you look from the outside in?

      Budget hasn’t been set yet as I’ve not got any idea of what structural work would be required. I am assuming steel beams would have to be installed to support the frame and the roof above. Not sure what happens to the internal wall & window boards etc. I presume they get taken down and made good.

      Is the first port of call to speak to a Structural Engineer?

      What would you budget for a corner bifold that is 3.65m wide with a 0.9m return?

    • PRO
      Room-by-Room (UK) Ltd
      3 years ago

      Could you please confirm the proposed size of the extension?

    • choco_bear
      Original Author
      3 years ago

      Not an extension, so to speak, as it would be replacing the current patio doors and windows. Picture attached. Width 3.65m, return each end 0.9m. Height 2.1m (internal height).

    • PRO
      Room-by-Room (UK) Ltd
      3 years ago

      You need to speak to a structural engineer.

      The main issue with this design is the amount that the cantilevered beam deflects or bends at the end.. I was told by an engineer a long time ago that if the cantilever is 1M you need 2M at the other end. The engineer will design a beam that reduces the deflection to an acceptable tolerance which will allow the bi-fold doors to operate.

      I would estimate a budget figure of around £40K is reasonable.

      If you manage to build the extension for less then you will have done well.

    • choco_bear
      Original Author
      3 years ago

      Yes I think I will do, thanks. It may be that the best option would be to avoid the corner bifold.
      £40k seems high - how have you arrived at that figure out of interest? I’d thought somewhere in region of £6-7k for the doors supplied and installed once the initial structural work had been completed.

    • PRO
      Room-by-Room (UK) Ltd
      3 years ago

      Within the last five years I have designed three similar extension concepts. None were built with the cantilever due to the expensive design solution.

      I don't know the size of the room but if the glazed area is 25% or greater than the floor area of the room you may need a SAP calculation.


    • choco_bear
      Original Author
      3 years ago

      Hi Sarah. Yes this would be replacing the current windows and doors only, not extending at all. No don’t be silly, it’s always good to hear all sides on this kind of thing. I think because we want to replace the paving slabs that you can currently see with decking we thought that sliding or bifold doors would really accentuate the decking and have a seamless inside to outside, but if it’s too expensive to do, or too much of a faff, then we won’t do it! Interesting to hear you say you haven’t used the bifolds - is that because of the weather or other reasons?

    • Sarah U-S
      3 years ago

      There’s another post on Houzz at the moment about doors! I think that the main reason that people don’t often use them fully is that they are a faff!! You have to unclip each section, which in theory is simple - they have bolts at the top and and bottom of each section to keep them secure. However the reality is that they become stiff. It’s just not a quick process to do. If I had your current doors, I would simply unlock and push them open!! It’s an even slower process to close them - you have to get them into the correct position to be able to close the bolts back - and because they get stiff, it can feel like a battle! Also - on the hot summer days when I thought we would want the doors open, my teenagers insist on keeping them closed because they hate the flies and bees etc coming in. I guess it all depends on how you live. If you decide it’s for you and you get a reasonable quote, go for it! However if it requires expensive structural work, you are unlikely to regain that in the value of the house because your current set up looks great and isn’t devaluing your property.

    • Mags D
      3 years ago

      Hi Choco_bear. I tend to agree with Sarah. We currently have 3m bifolds in 4 panels and we only ever open the first two. It’s just too much of a faff to use the others - although possibly ours are unusually stiff and tricky to use. We are planning an extension soon and instead of bifolds we’ll be having sliders as we still want a full view of the garden. You may have already done this but I’d go and view some different types and have a go of using them - if covid restrictions allow of course 🙄. Happy planning!! X

    • choco_bear
      Original Author
      3 years ago

      Thank you Sarah and Hannah, it’s definitely good to hear from people who have experience of them! I wonder if sliding doors may be a better option, or double doors that fold back further than 90 degrees as they will just stick out on to the decking and be in the way. Some more research definitely required! I’ll have a look out for that Houzz story on doors!

    • Sarah U-S
      3 years ago

      You might find that your existing doors fold back more than 90 degrees - they often have a limiter on them that can be taken off.

    • Victoria
      3 years ago

      The reason the doors don’t open further than 90 degrees is that they would hit on the stone cill. If you want them to open further you need to have different hinges so they aren’t impeded.

    • PRO
      Eulinea Ltd
      3 years ago

      Sliding doors might be a good option, with the two sides being fixed windows, full height and frameless - for a modern look. Cortizo do a good selection of aluminium sliding doors if you would like to search them - good luck! Irina

    • choco_bear
      Original Author
      3 years ago

      Hi Irina, that sounds great actually, thank you. As an Architect, does what you’re suggesting seem a straight forward job? Is there anything I should specifically be considering when budgeting these works? Thanks

    • PRO
      Eulinea Ltd
      3 years ago

      Hi Choco_bear, your builder needs to check the integrity of your beam holding this small roof, as the sliding doors can be heavy, and he will have to re-build the two corners as these also need to have sufficient strength, as you mentioned above. A Structural Engineer will have to work along with your Architect to co-ordinate this, and you need to budget so that both the exterior render and also the internal plasterboard cover some of the sliding door frames, to achieve a slender look. You might wish to incorporate two exterior wall lights on the newly built corners, or if there is sufficient overhang, a few downlights in the soffit if you like...

    • choco_bear
      Original Author
      3 years ago

      Thank you Irina that’s great advice I really appreciate it. Love your ideas.

    • Paul
      3 years ago

      I seem to have had a better experience with bifold doors than others, perhaps because mine consist of only 3 panels? The left hand one is a single door that opens to the left, then it's a case of twist the handle between the other 2 doors and push, and they fold to the right. Closing is a case of pulling them closed and twisting the handle back, then closing the single door. It takes seconds, and I have them wide open on any warm day (especially as the garden is south facing!) The total width is just under 3m with each panel being marginally under 1m wide.

      Having said that, although I can fully understand the desire to open up completely, if the BBQ is remaining in the position shown, you don't gain a huge amount by opening the return, and only opening the rear facing side could be cheaper. Bifold, sliding, french doors are all options - is it worth visiting a window / door supplier to look at their showroom and getting a builder to talk through costs?

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