Extension ideas needed!

3 years ago

Hi, we are going to buy a ground floor flat with an odd layout - currently 2 bedroom but the 2nd bedroom is too far from the main one. Thinking of maybe extending living room and add kitchen there, so we can make bedroom in the current kitchen instead. garden is huge so no limits to the rear, but can't imagine any extension that would provide natural light to all rooms. Any ideas what can be done with this flat, given the huge garden?

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Jonathan

3 years ago

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Comments (15)

keiblem
3 years ago
Not sure this will work but I shall make a stab at it. Could you open up the front bedroom, bathroom and that small area of hall and make that a living/ kitchen. Put a kitchen along the wall opposite the bay window with a long island dividing the space. Make the reception a bedroom the kitchen a bathroom and utility. If you move the current kitchen door to the middle of the flat you could create a central hall running to the rear with doors to the left into the utility and bathroom. Extend the rear bedroom a small way to the side to enlarge it and allow a door to be fitted at the end of the hall.
Anna Zy thanked keiblem
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The Island serves as a good go between from one side of kitchen to other - and a shopping bag drop zone to the pack the fridge and pantry. And as a work surface to put hot things coming out of the oven ! If you decide to scrap the island, then you will need a landing /drop zone for these uses near/on the oven and fridge run. Suggest you have open pantry /book /basket shelving on left wall just inside the room entrance door to stop doors conflicting if you intend to have a self closing fire door here . Modern integrated FF's can be placed next to ovens with no problem - usually I'd suggest FF hinge position next to oven side* to avoid blasts of heat going into FF if both opened at same time. Arrangement would also depend on primary users left or right handed status . As main walkway between oven/FF run and seating area at back of island i'd suggest .95m clearance between front of island and hob run and 1.23m between seating and tall cabinets in this instance. Then be mindful of DW placement so as not to interfere with standing room in front of hob as lots of us leave the DW open for some time while stacking ! *Nb. In America they wouldn't approve if you put the oven on that wall as its the main walkway - it would probably be suggested to be placed on horizontal bottom wall . It's quite sensible if you think about it ! For a professional independent kitchen plan that you can shop around with - you can contact an independent kitchen planner (like me) If you like ! Click on my name to be taken to my pro page for examples and prices etc ! You will save much more than the design fee by shopping around and comparing like for like !!! Kind regards Karen OnePlan
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Jonathan's suggested layout looks far more sensible to me - I looked with some horror at that huge wasted space between the kitchen and utility. Rob has suggested you consider air conditioning - it might be worth finding a consultant on natural ventilation. (Not sure how you find one, but the RIBA might assist, or I can ask my dad, who is a retired architect.) The one thing I can tell you, having twice had major building work done (and I swore never again after the first one...) is that the more thought you put in up front, the less likely you are to regret design choices and find yourself with costly extra works. Best of luck!
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One idea I would consider would be turning your current kitchen into a snug and utility by the side door, replace the conservatory with a full width extension, removing as many internal walls as possible and incorporating half the garage. No windows on the north side and place a fire along the north wall, kitchen on the south wall to create a large kitchen /diner/living room.
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keiblem
3 years ago
I like the idea of an inner courtyard. I imagine it isn’t critical which end you put your kitchen and living. That will be determined by your preferences and the location of the drains.

There is just one thing I find distracting. The proportions of the front bedroom seem odd. I appreciate that it was originally a large room and the bathroom was added later. Does it work for you? If not could the bathroom be moved a tad into the second bedroom? Perhaps the cost would be too much unless you plan a refit.
Anna Zy
Original Author
3 years ago
last modified: 3 years ago
How about this one? There is nothing above the second bedroom so we might try to install roof lights and move the inner wall between the rooms.
keiblem
3 years ago
You would just have borrowed light in the reception, will that be enough? Have you spoken to the neighbours above? They may object to you building up in front of their window.
Anna Zy
Original Author
3 years ago
well, we haven’t spoken with the neighbors yet but yeah, planning should be done responsively...
keiblem
3 years ago
I am sorry to say it but if I t were me I would object very strongly so before you invest any time and money it would be prudent to have a word with them.

In truth I think it would be highly unlikely that you would get planning permission but it wouldn’t do any harm to contact planning to ask their advice.
Anna Zy
Original Author
3 years ago
If you need just 3 metres to the rear you don’t even need planning permission (in case of my drawings, for example).
PRO
Studio Viridiana
3 years ago
Hi Anna,

I'd personally want lots of light in both the kitchen and reception. It is an idea to move the reception where the main bedroom is as keiblem suggests, but, given that you have a garden I think it would be nicer to have the reception and kitchen with access to the garden for when you have guests over.

I'd build out the extension where the patio is - and redo the current extension (which is the current extra bedroom). The extension could be glass and steel frame - possibly with skylights, and open plan: kitchen where extra bedroom currently is and reception/living where the current garden patio is (or vice versa).

I would return the main bedroom to how it used to be before the bathroom was added and move that ensuite bathroom over a little (you could a sequence of rooms - main bedroom - walk in closet room - main bathroom very lush :) ). This in turn makes what is the current reception room a bit smaller, and that could be your extra bedroom (blocking off the door to the new extension of course). You open up the hall so to create a corridor to the new reception and kitchen extension. The current kitchen becomes a bit smaller and becomes the bathroom for the second bedroom/ a guest bathroom.

Hope this helps! - feel free to reach out if its confusing in any way :). x
minnie101
3 years ago
Hi Anna, just reading your last comment (and I may be wrong or interpreted your comment incorrectly!) but I’m not sure permitted development rights apply for a flat.

https://www.planningportal.co.uk/info/200130/common_projects/21/flats_and_maisonettes/3
keiblem
3 years ago
I don’t know that 3 metres to the rear includes building right outside your neighbours window on the upper floor. Put yourself in their shoes apart from swapping a view for a brick wall it would very likely strip thousands off the value of their flat and make it difficult for them to sell.
Jonathan
3 years ago
It appears to me that the current kitchen is down a couple of steps from the main house and that the ground floor has high ceilings- this means that the first floor flat would be much higher than your extension and look straight over your extension roof so should not be a problem.

Furthermore your building work might allow them to also extend out from the bay window over your current kitchen (assuming this is their flat and not the stairs).

Of course you also have to get freeholder permission.
David Crossman
3 years ago
Surely the starting point is have a friendly chat with residents above. Even if you obtain the relevant permissions will you be happy living there if there is friction with the other occupants of the building. Remember to inform your building insurer before commencing any structural work - plenty of builders carry out work without adequate insurance cover of their own leaving the home owner liable when things go wrong.
Da Ra
3 years ago
100% you’ll need both planning permission and freeholder consent. Permitted development rights only apply to houses not flats (including converted houses like this one).

Freeholder may also wish to charge a fee / premium to allow the extension. This could be costly. You should make enquiries with the freeholder immediately in this regard. This also includes structural internal changes. Your lease may require you to seek freeholder consent for any structural changes not just building the extension. The freeholder may want surveys and a proposed drawing to approve. 99% of the time this is your cost to cover. The freeholder doesn’t suffer any expense.

Once you have agreement from the freeholder then you are comfortable to commit money to planning applications. Keep in mind just because you get planning consent doesn’t mean you can build and vice versa. You need both planning and freeholder consent to avoid either a planning breach or a lease breach. You will also need building control but this is a much easier process. If however there are manholes in the area you wish to extend be mindful that you will need to get consent from the water board to either move or obtain a build over agreement with them. The build over agreement is a requirement even if you are not building directly over the manhole but are building with a certain distance of the manhole. They will likely require CCTV footing before snd after the extension is built as well as site plans all of which you will have to pay for.

If successful and you do build, remember to create a new lease plan showing the entirety of the newly formed layout and update land registry. This will save you a painful process when you come to sell as your buyers solicitor will check the lease plan. If it’s incorrect they’ll class it as a defective lease and request it’s updated with land registry which can prolong the process.

I can see a few good options for the extension and a good architect probably won’t have any issues putting plans together for you.

Good luck.

Hope that helps.

(Experienced developer and estate agent for approximately 20 years and have seen many situations like this 😉).
PRO
B & E Partnership
3 years ago
The advice given by Da Ra is 100 % correct. I have previously stated on this Forum on a similar issue : ' Permitted development rights only apply to houses not flats (including converted houses like this one.' I think it's about time that the Planning Laws are updated to cater for for Flats and Maisonettes. I would call it Planning Racism not much different to BLM.

Houzz should take this case to The Royal Institute of Town Planning as well as with the Local Government of this Planning to be revised to have the same rights as all Private Home Owners.

Alain B

Extension ideas needed!

Jonathan

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