second floor bathroom

Reply to: My bathroom is almost exactly like yours, and we remodeled it last year. We used a Kohler Wellworth toilet. It has a small round bowl and a smaller tank that makes the space between the vanity and the wall seem larger. It was absolutely the smallest traditional toilet we could find, and we are very pleased with it.

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Reply to: I think the 'public restroom look' of a wall hung toilet (or even tankless w/c) is removed with the décor of the room itself. I agree with lefty47, shop your sources. The 3rd pic shows the style lefty47 mentioned with the long bowl that might be more of what you are looking for in a residential bathroom style. Here are a few pics of wall hung w/c's or tankless toilets that don't appear "public" to me:

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Reply to: Let me know if this is the sort of info you're looking for, if it's too basic, or not inclusive enough. It's a rough first draft and can be edited as required: The sort of where, what, and why of pressure-balanced versus thermostatic: Pressure-balanced or thermostatic temperature control valves are code-required in bathroom plumbing because they eliminate potential scalding and cold water shocks that can occur in a shower. If you are using the shower and a toilet is flushed, as the toilet uses cold water to refill the tank, the pressure in the cold water line drops a bit below what it was when just the shower was running. If you had a non-balancing valve, youd still get the same amount of hot water that you originally were getting, but with the drop in pressure in the cold water line youÂd have less cold water coming out of your shower head, creating a potential for scalding. Vice-versa, if someone turns on a hot-water faucet elsewhere in the house, the hot water pressure drops and you get a shower of mostly cold water. A pressure-balanced shower valve is designed to compensate for changes in water pressure. It has a mechanism inside that moves with a change in water pressure to immediately balance the pressure of the hot- and cold-water inputs. These valves keep water temperature within a couple degrees of the initial setting. They do it by reducing water flow through either the hot or cold supply as needed. Because pressure balanced valves control the temp by reducing the flow of water through the valve, if your plumbing supply is already struggling to keep up with the three shower heads and nine body sprays that you have running in your shower, if a pressure balancing valve kicks in and chokes down the water supply to keep you from getting scalded you could end up with insufficient water flow out of the heads in a multiple shower head setup. When it comes to volume control, in terms of being able to turn on the water a little or a lot, for the most part pressure-balanced valves are full-on when water is flowing or full-off when the valve is closed. Flow-wise, think of them as having no middle ground. Where flow and volume control are important, as in a shower that requires a high volume of water, a thermostatic valve may be the better choice. They also control the temperature, but they do not reduce the amount of water flowing through the valve in doing so. Thermostatic valves are also common with 3/4" inlets and outlets, so they can pass more water through the valve than a 1/2" pressure balancing valve. Which should you choose? In a larger multi-outlet master shower, while a 1/2" thermostatic valve may suffice, a 3/4" thermostatic valve might be the better choice. But it does depend on the design of your shower and the volume of water that can be passed through your houses supply lines. In a secondary bathroom, or in a basic master where you have only one head, or the common shower head/tub spout diverter valve, a 1/2" pressure balancing valve would be fine. If you want individual control and wanted multiple valves controlling multiple heads, then you could use multiple 1/2" valves instead of one 3/4" valve and all would be just fine. What do the controls on the valve actually control? While it may vary, a pressure balanced valve is normally an "all in one" valve with only one thing you can adjustÂthe temperature. The valve usually just has one rotating control (lever or knob) where you turn the water on, and by rotating it you set the water to a certain temperature. Each time you turn the valve on youÂll have to set it to the same spot to set it to your desired temperature. For the most part you really donÂt control the volume, just the temperature. With the valve spun a little bit, you'll get 100% flow but it will be all cold water. With the valve spun all the way, youÂll get 100% flow, but it will be all hot water. Somewhere int eh middle youÂll find that Goldilocks "just right" temperature, and itÂll be atÂyou guessed itÂ100% flow. So with a pressure balancing valve, you control the temp, but when the valve is open, itÂs open. A thermostatic valve can be all inclusive in terms of control (volume and temp) or just be temperature controlling. If itÂs just temperature controlling, you will need a separate control for volume or flow. Example, with an all inclusive youÂll have two "controllers" (knobs or levers) on the valve, one to set the temperature and a separate one to set the volume. In this case you can set the temp as you like it, then use the volume control lever to have just a trickle of Goldilocks water come out of the valve, or you can open it up and have full flow of Goldilocks water coming out of the valve. You can leave the temp where you like it when you turn the volume off after youÂre done showering. The next time you shower, turn the volume on, the temperature is already set. Some thermostatic valves are just temperature valves with no volume control. YouÂll need another valve/control to set the volume. Read the product description carefully to see what you're getting. What size valve should I get? Yes, valves actually come in different sizes. The size refers to the size of the inlet/outlet nipples on the valve. For a basic shower, a 1/2" valve will suffice. For a larger multi-head arrangement, a 3/4" valve would be better. Realize that youÂll need a water heater that can supply the volume of heated water you want coming out of the heads, so donÂt forget that when you build or remodel. Also realize that if youÂre remodeling and have 1/2" copper running to your shower, capping 1/2" copper supply tubing with a 3/4" valve provide you with much benefit as the 1/2" tubing is the limiting factor. You can, however, cap 3/4" supply tubing with a 1/2" valve or a 3/4" valve. Is one better than another? Thermostatic valves are "better" in that with them you can control both volume of flow and temperature, so you have more control, and they hold the temperature to a closer standard (+/- 1 degree). They also perform better if you are running multiple outlets in the shower, as they do not choke down the amount of water in order to control the temperature. But you pay for that added flow and added control. Pressure balancing valves can be had for about $100-$200, thermostatic valves can be twice that amount. And more. Will I suffer with a pressure-balancing valve? For what itÂs worth, when I built my house over 10 years ago I put pressure-balancing valves in my own house. While I have two outlets in my shower (sliding bar mounted hand-held on the wall and an overhead 12" rain shower head on the ceiling), I have a two separate pressure-balancing valves, one valve for each head. With both heads going in the shower, I notice no loss of flow in the shower when the toilet is flushed and the sink faucet is turned on simultaneously. I also notice no change in temperature. So they work for me. If you are remodeling, if you have your existing sink running and you flush the toilet and notice a drop in volume coming out of the sink, then a thermostatic valve might be the better choice even if you're not having a multi-head setup installed. If, as part of the remodel, you plan on running new supply lines through your house to the new bath, then properly sized runs will take care of that flow restriction and you can probably do a pressure balancing valve instead of a thermostatic. So in a house with tricky plumbing, or with a restricted water supply, or with multiple outlets running off of one supply valve, a thermostatic valve might be the safer choice. Mongo

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Reply to: Part Deux: Controls and Diverters This may be almost impossible to thoroughly attack because there are so many variations in what people want and in what different manufacturers offer. In general You need a volume and temperature control. You can buy just the valve body, which is the chunk of expensive brass that gets buried in the wall, and buy a separate trim kit, or you can buy a package that includes the valve body and the trim kit. The trim kit is the bright sparkly metallic knob/lever/escutcheon bling that you overspend for so your friends and neighbors will go "oooooh" and "aaaaah". If you buy a pressure balanced valve, the valve in and of itself will turn on the water and allow you to control the temperature. If you buy a thermostatic valve, most valve bodies have two controllers on them, one to control volume and one to control temperature. Read the fine print though, because some thermostatic bodies just control temperature. Youll need a separate valve body to provide volume control. Stops. Some valves come with "stops" some do not. What are stops? Stops stop water flow at the valve itself so the valve can be taken apart without having to turn the water off to that branch circuit or to the whole house. They are normally incorporated onto the hot and cold water inlets on the valve body, and they can be opened or closed with a screw driver. While Im on this, Ill also mention that some valves might mention having a "stop screw" to limit the maximum temperature. While a pressure balancing or a thermostatic valve will prevent you from being scalded if someone flushes a toilet, there is nothing to prevent someone from being scalded by setting the valve to allow 130 degree water to pass through it. Your first step is to lower the temperature on your water heater to about 120 degrees. For valves that have these stop screws, its then a simple matter of setting a screw that limits how far the temperature knob can be rotated. What you do is rotate the knob to set the water to the max temp that youd ever want out of the shower, then you turn the set screw until it bottoms out. It will now prevent the temperature knob from turning past (hotter than) its existing position. Downstream of that volume/temp control is where things get dicey. You can have a simple setup where your V/T control just runs to a single shower head. Easy to do. You can have a standard tub setup with a shower head and a tub spigot, where the diverter can be a lever or push button that sends water either to the tub spigot below or to the shower head above. Also easy to do. If you want to supply water to more than one shower head, to a shower head and body sprays, or to both, either simultaneously or one at a time, then youll need more chunks of expensive brass to bury in your wall. If you want separate controls and the ability to have differing temperatures come out of differing fixtures, then its easiest to go with multiple V/T controllers. One V/T controller for the shower heads, for example, and a separate V/T controller for the body sprays. This allows you to run different volumes and different temperatures out of the different heads. Your shower head can be 105 degrees and your body sprays 110 degrees. Remember, the more hot water that you want to come out of your shower, the larger your supply tubing and valve bodies need to be, and the larger your water heater has to be. For sizing purposes, most shower heads and body sprays have a gallon per minute rating applied to them. In theory and planning only, if your hand held shower head is, for example, rated at 3gpm, your rain shower head rated at 4gpm, and each of your 8 body spray heads is rated at 1gpm, and you want to run them all at the same timeyoure looking at a flow of 15gpm. You need a water heater that can supply you with 15gpm of hot water, then you need supply tubing that can get 15gpm of hot water from your water heater to your bathroom, and you need valve/diverter bodies that can pass the required amount of water through them so you get decent flow out of each fixture. Typical plumbing is 1/2", typical valves are 1/2". For high volume situations, 3/4" tubing and 3/4" supply valves may be required. Out of the valves you can usually run 1/2" tubing to your shower heads and body spray heads. Back to the hardware. If you want a shower head and body sprays, and want to run either or both off of one valve, then youll want a diverter valve. Diverter valves can be anything and everything. They can be simple A/B valves, where you can run the water through the valve to only "A", your shower head, or only to "B", your body spray heads. But not both at the same time. Which leads to the A/B/AB valve, where you can send water only to "A", your shower head, or only to "B", your body spray heads, or to "AB", simultaneously to both. And from here things go wild. There are A/B/C/AB/AC/BC/ABC valves, and things just can go on and on from there. Diverter valves are usually described as having a certain number of "ports". 3-port, 4-port, 5-port, etc. Realize that one port is where the water goes in to the valve, the other ports are where the water comes out. So an A/B/C valve that has three outlets might be listed as a "4-port valve", with the fourth port being the inlet. Not all 4-port valves can do A/B/C/AB/AC/BC/ABC, youll need to look through the description to find out where it can send the water to. A 4-port valve might just be an A/B/C valve, or it might be a more versatile A/B/C/AB/AC/BC valve. Read its description. If you cant get the customization you need from a single volume/temperature controller and a single diverter, you can run multiple diverters off of one V/T controller, or multiple diverters off of multiple V/T controllers. It all depends on how much brass you can afford, how much water you can supply, and if you have the space to hide all that brass in your walls. Diverters can be knobs, levers, push buttons, the choice is yours. But do remember that you need to match up the valve body to the desired trim kit so that the bling that your neighbors can see will fit on the expensive chunk of brass that they cant see. You dont want your plumber to bury that expensive chunk of brass in your wall, then tile, then find out later that your bling wont fit. Very depressing. Its all about reading the fine print. Mongo

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Reply to: Q - "What is needed besides the tub spout, the shower head, and the on/off thingy?" A - As for plumbing needs there are many things not seen and possibly not included with your plumbing hardware. Your tub filler may slide over a section of 1/2" copper or may thread into a Brass fitting. Your thermostatic control or temperature control valve needs to have integral stops (shut offs at this point - some have them built in others you need to purchase them). Plumbers use plumbers grease to lubricate O rings, they use Teflon tape to wrap threaded joints. Most fixtures like body, jets, steamer outputs and showerheads mount to a 1/2" brass fitting. Items like copper, solder, flux, Pex pipe, Pex rings and a selection of 90 degree and 45 degree fittings. Steam pipe needs to be insulated, as do many water lines. Water lines should not touch metal or cross each other. Electrical tape, pipe tie downs and pipe fasteners can be used to prevent this behind the walls. Q - "For a shower configuration (like the master bathroom with a separate tub) what is needed beside the shower head and on /off thingy?" A - Mongo explained this very well - all I'll add is that there are so many ways to do this and so many different valves. I installed a Grohe fixture that could control both a handheld and the shower head - or both from one fixture and with only a 1/2" supply. Make sure when your talking to your plumbing retailer and looking for your package you ask this questions "Is this everything I'll (my plumber) will need?" With that take your answer with a grain of salt and then call the supplier direct and review with them your purchase. My experience over the years is that there is always something missed that turns out to slow the process down. The finish material does not line up with the rough in, there was not built in stop, the discharge is a sweated fitting and not threaded - etc. Q - "What optional fixtures do you like (handheld, stuff like that) ?" A - I think a second handheld for rinsing shampoo out of your hair and helping clean the shower is a great idea. My wife is a large water hog (blankets for that matter too) and I'm looking forward to the second supply (my supply) when showering together. I'm waiting for inspections and just finished up installing our new boiler and water lines for some Column Radiators. I'll post a few pictures of the rough in work with descriptions to help label the "Thingings and Whacamacallit's".

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Reply to: Anna, I copied your beautiful bath -- right down to the ming green basketweave floor & the lavender paint! I hope you check back here so that you can see how you inspired me. Here are some pictures: Thank you, thank you, thank you! Copying you was better -- and less expensive -- than hiring an designer. Hope you don't mind ...

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Reply to: Yes, the border is a marble mosaic. It comes on a mesh backing in about one-foot lengths. Amazingly, every single piece was almost identical in terms of the colors and shapes of the pieces. Here's a close-up: And yes, the vanity is 60 inches wide. It comes in several finishes, with and without legs, double and single sinks. If you google "Strasser vanity" you will find several sources online.

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Reply to: I think I found the matching toilet seat!! Do you think it's sea-green? https://www.plumbingsupply.com/images/colored-toilet-seat-round-sea-green.jpg

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Reply to: Add black to it

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Reply to: Yes, if you are going to change the tile to another tile you will demo the tile and the wall board behind it. That will expose the valve and water supply lines for the tub. Call a plumber to install the new valve. (Also it would be good to inspect the trip level/overflow for the bath drain and possibly get that replaced at the same time. Remember most plumbing companies charge a trip fee per visit and then hourly so try to get them to do all the work they can on the same visit. This will save a lot of money. Also have them change out the angle stops (water supply valve) for the toilet and hot/cold sink because they are usually nasty and if they are old they tend not to shut off all they way when you disconnect the line to change fixtures) After they do the plumbing work then the new cement board can go up, waterproofing applied and tiling can begin. After the tile work is done then you have to put the finished trim for the plumbing on. This isn't too hard if you are handy and you could probably do yourself to save a few $ or call the plumber back to to the trim out. Even though the tub is green, these are great tubs and will probably last many more decades. Back when american made really meant quality. cheers!

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